Logo
Registered Members Login:
   
Forgotten Your Details? Click Here To Recover +
Welcome to ShareScene - Talk Shares And Take Stock With Australia's Sharemarket Community - New Here? Click To Register >

2 Pages (Click to Jump) V   1 2 >   
 
  
Reply to this topic

Le Tour de France
OZGAZ
post Posted: Jul 26 2011, 04:34 PM
  Quote Post


Posts: 1,550
Thanks: 114


In Reply To: wolverine's post @ Jul 26 2011, 02:27 PM

Wolverine, my point was that if we are having a thread about le Tour, let's discuss LeTour - tactics, the teams, the individuals the results, the dramas, the humour, the courage and the toughness of the competitors etc - you know - the race itself !!!!! not turn it into a thread about drugs in cycling, or for that matter drugs in sport. Create a new thread titled just that and let everyone have their tuppance worth on the subject on that one.
You mention Christie, Lewis , Armstrong and Flo Jo but they are now in the past and this is a new era as was evident in the fact only one guy tested positive and that was for a banned diuritic, of all things. All commentary points to slower times and the fact that many showed complete fatigue when crossing the finish line on the moutain stages. I'm not denying that in the past drug use was common (and common in many sports !) but I beg to differ in that cycling HAS come a long way in cleaning up it's image and continues to do so.
Once again, to reiterate, lets use the thread to discuss the race, not slag the sport.....

Cheers

Ozgaz



--------------------
Smile while TRADING it's only money... :)
 
wolverine
post Posted: Jul 26 2011, 02:27 PM
  Quote Post


Posts: 9,748
Thanks: 757


In Reply To: OZGAZ's post @ Jul 26 2011, 12:41 PM

OZGAZ it is fair to say it is a shame that a sport can be tarnished by performance enhancing drug use.

In my chosen sport I don't see people routinely injecting themselves prior to specific training such as weight training.....A close friend of mine was at SASI and his eyes popped when a box, syringes, needles were pulled out by a cycling athlete based in SA just for routine weight training. Now the said items being injected are not illegal...but I think this shows the belief that they need every little advantage they can get to perform at a high level.

I have no doubt that Armstrong has used EPO like many of his peers.

Lindford Christie and Frankie Fredericks (top bloke) trained in Australia well out of the gaze of their national testing systems....Lindford was caught at a later date.

Carl Lewis ran for the Santa Monica Track Club which had interesting affiliations with pharmaceutical industry....hmm. Not touching Flo Jo.

The best rise to the top under most circumstances but it doesn't mean they are clean.

I know of two knuckle heads in my sport that were on anabolic agents for a period of time, since they lacked a fair amount of ability it was never going to make any difference to them climbing the ladder. Another friend pretty much had to quit playing as he liked to have bit of a smoke and he could never pass ASDA testing on a consistent basis.

During the Sydney Games we were alcohol tested prior to officiating (on a random basis)....but we found that the machine wasn't working as my friend nearly melted the plastic tube after a huge night out and blew 0.00 the video tape of the test was pretty funny when it didn't register anything. My mate was ready to pack his bags in disgrace but got away with it.

Cadel thoroughly deserved his win equally if Andy Schleck had held the gap from that break he would have been a deserving winner but it doesn't change the fact cycling has a long way to go before they have earned the right to be seen as a clean sport.



--------------------
I AM THE OTHER WHITE MEAT
 
balance
post Posted: Jul 26 2011, 12:51 PM
  Quote Post


Posts: 5,095
Thanks: 351


In Reply To: OZGAZ's post @ Jul 26 2011, 12:41 PM

Fair call OZ. I love cycling and the tour is just an amazing event. I marvel at the toughness and level of fitness required. Evans is the 3rd non European to win it after Le Mond and Armstrong and the 1st Aussie to do so. I also dread the major tv stations getting their maulers into the tour now that they have discovered it exists. Congratulations to Cadel.



--------------------
Day Trader: Lowest form of life in the known universe.
Shorter: Can limbo under a day trader.
Investor: Salt of the Earth.Sits to the right of God (Warren Buffet)
Share prices are only ever manipulated down.
Paper losses are not really losses.
Chat site posters always know better & know more than anyone about anything.
I'm 29.
The cheque is in the mail.

Said 'Thanks' for this post: OZGAZ  
 
OZGAZ
post Posted: Jul 26 2011, 12:41 PM
  Quote Post


Posts: 1,550
Thanks: 114


Sick and tired of people continually bringing that old chestnut - drugs - up everytime Le Tour is mentioned. For bloody once can we not just revel in the victory for Cadel and also the beauty of the race itself. Yes it has had it's problems in the past but it is now a leader in drug detection which puts most other sports to shame from that perspective. It is not the only sport in the world and certainly not the ONLY sport which has it's fair share of drug issues, but nobody seems to mention other sports. How many footy types run around every weekend with pre-match jabs just to get them thru ! Name me a sport that has a biological passport attached to the participants that is checked against their blood analysis - and that testing is done constantly in and out of season. The top riders are tested after every stage and the financial cost of failing these days is astronomical -these penalties are built into all contracts and can be anywhere from 4 to 6 times what they earn yearly. Imagine if you were fined 4 times your annual salary for failing a drugs test at work...!
Now I have vented, this was one of the most exciting tours in a long time and naturally even more so that Cadel won it. They are all tough nuts and passionate about what they do. Contador was not on his game as he was involved in a few crashes and had a knee issue - not that he would let on how bad it was just as Cadel didn't really make a big issue last year when he rode with a broken elbow - thats how these boys are !
As for coverage - well funny how mainstream media have jumped on the bandwagon now that Cadel has won, because they certainly weren't around years ago when the rest of us knew what a massive event it was and how many Australians completed and were rockstars themselves in Europe. One used to have scour through pages of footy and horse racing just to find a small article on cycling. As far as I'm concerned the media can bugger off and leave it to SBS who have done a sensational job over many, many years and deserve to do so for many more years to come.

Cheers

Ozgaz

A passionate cyclist tongue.gif

PS - a big thankyou to Phil Ligget and Paul Sherwin who have done a fanatastic job in the commentary box for countless years. A magical pairing.



--------------------
Smile while TRADING it's only money... :)

Said 'Thanks' for this post: wren  arty  
 
mark100
post Posted: Jul 26 2011, 09:07 AM
  Quote Post


Posts: 169
Thanks: 7


In Reply To: triage's post @ Jul 26 2011, 08:18 AM

We just have to hope now with the increasing popularity of le tour in Australia we don't have Channel 7 or 9 try and bid for the TV rights. SBS do a great job, 7 or 9 would stuff it up with ads every 5 minutes.

 
triage
post Posted: Jul 26 2011, 08:18 AM
  Quote Post


Posts: 3,002
Thanks: 1033


In Reply To: henrietta's post @ Jul 26 2011, 07:23 AM

Yeah J you are probably right though I can fully understand Wasa's skepticism given how systemic the drugs problem has been in cycling.

As one of the officials reportedly said after the race this year's race even "looked" clean as everyone, including the gun riders, were running out of puff when you'd expect them to. The glaring example of that I thought was Alberto Contador who in past years would have powered away on those mountain breaks he made but this year did not. Also a couple of times when Evans or one of the Schlek boys tried to get away they were quickly rounded up by the others.

Anyway I thought Cadel or Cuddles as apparently he is known as on the circuit measured up in every way as a worthy champion.

Final note: thank god it was SBS that had the coverage. Their team showed lots of enthusiasm and national pride but were respectful and appreciative of the host nation and of the other competitors. In contrast I heard on channel 9 some airhead reporter say that the win confirms the sporting domination of Australia (yeah right, one win in 108 years). And in the Sydney Morning Herald today there are comparisons of Cadel with Don Bradman and a reporter wanted one of Cadel's team-mates to compare Cadel with Lance Armstrong (again, one win as against 7).



--------------------
"The market can stay irrational longer than you can stay solvent." John Maynard Keynes

"The crisis takes a much longer time coming than you think, and then it happens much faster than you would have thought." Rudiger Dornbush

"It is the mark of an educated mind to be able to entertain a thought without accepting it." Aristotle

Said 'Thanks' for this post: arty  
 


henrietta
post Posted: Jul 26 2011, 07:23 AM
  Quote Post


Posts: 3,616
Thanks: 475


In Reply To: triage's post @ Jul 24 2011, 10:13 AM

G'day Triage

I haven't heard anything to connect Evans with performance enhancement in all the years he has raced, either mountain biking or road racing. In my opinion he's clean and an incredible champion. I can't imagine how strong you have to be mentally, to get up each morning for three weeks and torture yourself for several hours every day. It's an awesome combination of experience, stamina, strength, mental toughness, and finally, luck.

We should be very proud of Cadel and I hope he enjoys his win as a legend in Australian sport for the rest of his life.

Cheers
J

QUOTE
Cadel Evansí wife Chiara Passerini has warned against assuming that all the big pro riders use banned substances, saying that her husband and many others have never broken rules and that it is unfair to judge them because some others have cheated.





Said 'Thanks' for this post: arty  
 
wasabibarako
post Posted: Jul 24 2011, 11:53 AM
  Quote Post


Posts: 2,045
Thanks: 136


In Reply To: triage's post @ Jul 24 2011, 10:13 AM

triage/others: IMHO, none of those riders are "clean". The trick/importance is to be "ahead of the curve" so to speak, i.e. dope with stuff that cannot yet be checked efficiently.
As all the riders - more or less - are doing it (again IMHO), there is still a "level playing field".
And, therefore, the victory of Cadel is indeed epic ! Well deserved, for certain.
wasa

 
triage
post Posted: Jul 24 2011, 10:13 AM
  Quote Post


Posts: 3,002
Thanks: 1033


You little champion, Cadel. biggrin.gif

I hope he's clean and I hope no disaster strikes him on the way to the finish line tonight as he seems to have put in an awesome effort over the last few weeks.

I have to admire the motor and the spirit these blokes have, not only Evans but the brothers Schlek and even the froggy chap who simply refused to lie down.

How's this for some classy comments:

QUOTE
"Cadel did the time trial of his life, and he deserves to win the Tour," said [Andy] Schleck, who had taken the race lead only 24 hours earlier from Frenchman Thomas Voeckler....

..."We know we did everything we could do in the mountains and today. Both Frank and I probably did the best time trials we have ever done, but it wasn't good enough. We don't have any regrets in this perspective."......"It's disappointing in a way, but if you look at the size and importance of the Tour, it's a real honour to be second especially when your brother is one step down," said Schleck.

"We would have hoped to have one Schleck on top of the podium, but we're proud of each other and proud of ourselves."


http://www.abc.net.au/news/2011-07-24/schl...l-evans/2807700

Also, on Friday night Voeckler seemed to be angry at the world and at his own body for not being able to keep up, at one stage slamming a water bottle onto the ground and another where he appeared to be screaming at his team-mates. But one of those riders then took off and won the stage, and later said that Voeckler had been telling him to take his own chances and go for glory.

Epic stuff imo.








--------------------
"The market can stay irrational longer than you can stay solvent." John Maynard Keynes

"The crisis takes a much longer time coming than you think, and then it happens much faster than you would have thought." Rudiger Dornbush

"It is the mark of an educated mind to be able to entertain a thought without accepting it." Aristotle
 
balance
post Posted: Jul 22 2011, 01:25 PM
  Quote Post


Posts: 5,095
Thanks: 351


In Reply To: arty's post @ Jul 22 2011, 01:19 PM

You mean this Arty ?
Bar Humbug



--------------------
Day Trader: Lowest form of life in the known universe.
Shorter: Can limbo under a day trader.
Investor: Salt of the Earth.Sits to the right of God (Warren Buffet)
Share prices are only ever manipulated down.
Paper losses are not really losses.
Chat site posters always know better & know more than anyone about anything.
I'm 29.
The cheque is in the mail.
 
 


2 Pages (Click to Jump) V   1 2 >

Back To Top Of Page
Reply to this topic


You agree through the use of ShareScene.com, that you understand and accept the TERMS OF USE.


TERMS OF USE  -  CONTACT ADMIN  -  ADVERTISING